Adjustments to “over the sight” shooting

[aggimajera]

Just replying to keep this thread at the top. I think its incredibly important to look at this.

[Brummbaer97]

I realy think that the bullet should always go where the barell is pointing to. Maybe lower the angle a bit so that the top of the ACOG alings with the front sight post. Like that you should still be able to hit an enemy in cqc but not at further Ranges.

[AmperCamper]

Just replying to keep this thread at the top. I think its incredibly important to look at this.

Thanks for the bump on this. I've passed it to the team for review, and we want to remind everyone that there is a balancing act at play here. Incorporating AOS point-shooting is something we hadn't seen done before, and logistically it's not exact. With that being said, our current implementation works in the ways that have been described to us. Of course, there are exceptions here and we're keeping this in mind.

[aggimajera]

Just replying to keep this thread at the top. I think its incredibly important to look at this.

Thanks for the bump on this. I've passed it to the team for review, and we want to remind everyone that there is a balancing act at play here. Incorporating AOS point-shooting is something we hadn't seen done before, and logistically it's not exact. With that being said, our current implementation works in the ways that have been described to us. Of course, there are exceptions here and we're keeping this in mind.

Yeah, like was said earlier. The aiming method itself is not the issue. The issue is the fact its still particularly effective outside of a CQB scenario.

Thanks for looking!

[Dague]

Yea super effective at engagements within 25 yards...however...once outside that it becomes useless and you should actually use your sights. Accuracy should decrease in this aiming mode significantly. Also keep in mind, that you are playing as a 03 infantryman in 2004/2005....most of these dudes were in high school a year before the Battle of Fallujah. Just 18/19-year-old kids who just graduated from MCRD/SOI and are scared. Although professional soldiers/Marines, they certainly weren't hitting hip shots/point shots at much more than the distance from one end of a room to another like seasoned operators.

[desertjedi]

I like AmperCamper's reply on this stating that it was a bit of a balancing act. Personally, when I have the M16 with scope, I DO NOT want to be "forced" to use the scope at any range. This game is so lethal that many times, by the time I raise the scope, orient my view, and then find the enemy, I'm already dead. I want to be able to use the end-of-barrel iron sight just as it's used now in SDIF. And yes, I understand that using the gun like this at long range is goofy. But it's a compromise I can live with. Ground Branch has a similar issue as that game lets you mount everything but the kitchen sink on top of your barrel.

[absent]

I 100% agree you should have AoS in the game.

I understand leaving it how it is for gameplay purposes as well, but even at close range within like 10 - 15 meters I have tested this with a boresight laser and a front sight post, you're shooting somewhere around 10" to 1 foot high at very close range. If you tried to shoot someone in the head at that range, you would miss almost every time. Shooting center mass you might get lucky and hit them in the neck or head, maybe. Maybe upper chest area if you're shooting at their stomach. You would be better off not even aiming at all and just point shooting irl than attempting to line your sights up like that.

The further away the target is, the higher it will be (I think, I haven't tested this but it makes sense logically, you're shooting at an upward angle). You'd probably be shooting over houses at like 100m+. I think adjusting it so you can shoot "off the scope cap" would be slightly less accurate but still good enough for most close encounters. I don't think it would be that hard to hit stuff that way.

Just my 2 cents though.

[Nomad]

This was one of the first few things that baffled me when I started playing...

I was firing lower at greater distances and not hitting my target. Took me awhile to realise that the sights were dead accurate no matter the distance.

I don't know if this is engine limitations or what, but I too, would like to see this tweaked in the future

[lines'n'angles]

Just replying to keep this thread at the top. I think its incredibly important to look at this.

Thanks for the bump on this. I've passed it to the team for review, and we want to remind everyone that there is a balancing act at play here. Incorporating AOS point-shooting is something we hadn't seen done before, and logistically it's not exact. With that being said, our current implementation works in the ways that have been described to us. Of course, there are exceptions here and we're keeping this in mind.

AOS point shooting has been a feature of countless games... Here's an example of a game that has the exact same technical method for (inaccurate) AOS point shooting behavior:



The bullet should NOT follow a line drawn between the shooter's eye and the tip of the front sight post, but in both games that is what is apparently done. 'logistically it's not exact' is one way to say that the bullets being shot an angle very far off from straight out of the barrel, at an angle far from 0... I say barrel only because in a post from last year (viewtopic.php?t=379) you state that bullets do fire from the barrel, not the sight. I'm not sure I believe that. Even if bullets came out the barrel at the angle necessary for current long-range AOS behavior, then POI would always be under tip of the post because of an extreme height over bore... This is an extremely blaring issue, and that's an understatement.

The incongruency is just SO obvious that it boggles me a bit, you can see it clearly with weapon mounted flashlights as shown earlier in this thread. Fixing this should be the highest priority. It's a very stark gameplay concession for a game supposedly concerned with realism and immersion. Your current method does not 'work in the ways described to us' because of lines'n'angles, because this game has ranges longer than 5 feet.

Even if bullet drop is ignored, bullet rays should be cast parallel to the barrel, no matter what. This whole issue can be reduced to this: Bullets should be parallel to the barrel, but when AOS shooting they aren't. Very simple.

[rodrigoxm49]

I like AmperCamper's reply on this stating that it was a bit of a balancing act. Personally, when I have the M16 with scope, I DO NOT want to be "forced" to use the scope at any range. This game is so lethal that many times, by the time I raise the scope, orient my view, and then find the enemy, I'm already dead. I want to be able to use the end-of-barrel iron sight just as it's used now in SDIF. And yes, I understand that using the gun like this at long range is goofy. But it's a compromise I can live with. Ground Branch has a similar issue as that game lets you mount everything but the kitchen sink on top of your barrel.

This. I've noticed just like anyone that aim over the sight is too much accurate for long distance, but we should not forget that this is a game. Maybe a little balance to make it less OP and force you to aim a little higher or lower, but balance is required since it's a videogame.