Difficulty Level

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Kean_1
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Re: Difficulty Level

Kronzky wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 3:13 pmThe issue is not whether it should be "dumbed down" or not, but whether the difficulty level is realistic.
Since this game is striving for realism, dying every 10 minutes (or patching yourself up every 5) will trivialize that situation, until you soon don't care anymore about whether you got shot, and you will end up playing it like CS or any die-respawn-die-respawn shooter.
Whereas, if getting injured/killed is an exceptional and rare event (reserved for situations where you really screwed up), and which might only happen every few hours, it will have a much larger impact on you.
There should be a constant *fear* of getting shot, but if you actually *are* getting shot every few minutes then it will just become a trivial, routine thing.
Personally, I think it is appropriate to have this game stay difficult. ....a real challenge that rewards good tactics, communication and teamwork. Keeping the game difficult also doesn't trivialize the experience. If anything, it's the opposite as others mentioned. ....and as Dague said, leaving the difficulty as is wouldn't turn it into a "die-respawn-die-respawn shooter" like CS, CoD, BF, etc. as that simply isn't how that works in this game.

My friends and I are completely on board with how challenging the game appeared in the videos. The only reason I mentioned a difficulty level option is because I think that's a better alternative vs. rebalancing the game to make it easier for all.
munchuh
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Re: Difficulty Level

More difficulty the better. As long as it's fair -- fair meaning that any death is because I fucked up, or just bad luck, and I am able to improve on what got me killed.
BobTank63
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Re: Difficulty Level

One more thing I thought of from the difficulty standpoint: two of the vets playing, DDG and Savage Actual, are playing solo. These missions are designed to be done as a group, so of course they would struggle doing the mission by themselves.
evan466
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Re: Difficulty Level

I've gone out of my way to watch any video I can find of vets playing and giving their reactions to the game so far, and from what I can tell the only ones that had an exceedingly difficult time were the ones playing solo, which is to be expected. The guys who played with full teams did much better.
Hagar
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Re: Difficulty Level

AmperCamper wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:56 pm Curious to hear everyone's thoughts on this.

The game punishes carelessness, and mistakes are going to cost you (and perhaps the whole team). But, it's not impossible. There's a unique balancing act that we're navigating. Of course, this can always be tuned.
I would say adding dificulty levels would be wise. Not everybody (the vast majority of gamers) is a Veteran, even less a Fallujah Veteran, or a trained soldier or police officer in real life. So i understand those who are very good and want a terrific challenge. Ok, set dificulty to max (actual setting IMO) The others should be able to choose something to the ability they have, so they can learn and not just be frustrated (so, 3 to 4 lvls of difficulty would be a wise move).

Game is awesome, but, IMO, too hard, even for a team (mainly if guys were/are not military).

When you say the game punishes (...) but its not impossible, its all said. Ok, its not impossible... Unless you are aiming for a very small community of gamers (remember there is SQUAD, Ready or Not, and other games out there), common sense is of the essence ;)

Congrats, and thank you for your work!
MentallyJacked65
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Re: Difficulty Level

This is the first shooter I have ever purchased that I was not sceptical about but I was worried I would not be good enough to play along with the elite players. I am mostly a solo player, and if it is online (COD which I have grosive wn not to like at all and BF which used to be excellent but now it's all run and gun). I have watched hours upon hours of some of the top gamers play this game and most of them are getting slaughtered. I am watching professional gamers play this game and they love it but they too are having trouble because of it's difficulty level.
I do love the agressive AI, how they flank, how accurate they are, etc. Abeing that this is ISIS story based, well, enough said and yeah, I am enjoying it expecting to die alot just like Dark Souls or any real rediculously difficult game. But it is more realistic, you can't really run fast, jump or climb so you have to be patient and think. The AI is too spot on with accuracy. And the AR-15 has too much recoil, it takes 4-5 bullets to kill a bad .
I love the game, I am anxious for the updates, I was expecting so hard that I would not progress, I don't have online or friends to log in with so I will be at the whim of online friends.
I do disagree with AmperCamper that the game punishes carelessness, I am super careful and try to be as mindful as possible as a single playing person can be and the most I kill is 4-5 before I get killed (out of no where) either from being too cautious or because I have checked everywhere, I crouch, walk to my next and an AI smokes me.
So, long story short, program a few servers that offer a lesser difficulty (not half) just a little bit, even 25% at first just to see if that helps. Headshots are 1 shot, but at a distance it's hard to get the AI in scope at a distance even at 20% sensitivity. Thanks for a fantastic game, just needs to be a little easier to be 1000% more enjoyed. *** I am only speaking for the Single Player Version ***
Last edited by MentallyJacked65 on Mon Jun 26, 2023 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Doc_Savage
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Re: Difficulty Level

Personally i think coop difficulty should tweaked a bit, but when single player campaign comes to us i would like to see a difficulty level added.
rodrigoxm49
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Re: Difficulty Level

Kronzky wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:54 pm After having watched all the pre-release gameplay videos posted by those veterans, and seeing them fail left and right, I'm starting to worry about about the difficulty level of this game.

After all, these are trained and experienced pros. They survived the real thing, and they should be able to survive the game. But instead, they're dropping like flies.
This would be like handing a race game to Lewis Hamilton, and him wiping out at every other corner. If that happens there's something wrong with the game, not with Lewis Hamilton.

I mean, I'm all for hard games (there are way too few of them), but if you're going for realism then dying should be the exception, rather than the rule. (And should only happen if you really, really screwed up. The real numbers were about 2,000 troops involved, and having 27 deaths. In the game it seems to be the other way round...)
I don't have any problems to not die in this game (it doens't mean that I not die, but it's not too often). I think there's nothing to tweak, at the risk of making the game extremely easy. I haven't seen a single situation where I considered it unfair to have died or been shot. The difficulty is fine, in my opinion. The game is made to be absolutely brutal and have no mercy. US marines are good on real life, a videogame is extremely different even if you know the CQB concepts.

This is not a Mario Bros games, guys. Train, apply the concepts and you will be rewarded. That's the fun of though game, guys.
Hagar
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Re: Difficulty Level

rodrigoxm49 wrote: Mon Jun 26, 2023 1:18 pm
Kronzky wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:54 pm After having watched all the pre-release gameplay videos posted by those veterans, and seeing them fail left and right, I'm starting to worry about about the difficulty level of this game.

After all, these are trained and experienced pros. They survived the real thing, and they should be able to survive the game. But instead, they're dropping like flies.
This would be like handing a race game to Lewis Hamilton, and him wiping out at every other corner. If that happens there's something wrong with the game, not with Lewis Hamilton.

I mean, I'm all for hard games (there are way too few of them), but if you're going for realism then dying should be the exception, rather than the rule. (And should only happen if you really, really screwed up. The real numbers were about 2,000 troops involved, and having 27 deaths. In the game it seems to be the other way round...)
I don't have any problems to not die in this game (it doens't mean that I not die, but it's not too often). I think there's nothing to tweak, at the risk of making the game extremely easy. I haven't seen a single situation where I considered it unfair to have died or been shot. The difficulty is fine, in my opinion. The game is made to be absolutely brutal and have no mercy. US marines are good on real life, a videogame is extremely different even if you know the CQB concepts.

This is not a Mario Bros games, guys. Train, apply the concepts and you will be rewarded. That's the fun of though game, guys.
Dude, thats the point. Not everyone is like you that play so well, keep this lvl of difficulty, fine! Just add other lvls less difficult so more people can enjoy. No one wants to take your fun away, we just want to have fun ourselves. Yeah war is hard, but this a computer game, unless you want to make it just for veterans, and then hope most of them dont get frustrated because they cant succeed here like they did IRL...
rodrigoxm49
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Re: Difficulty Level

Hagar wrote: Tue Jun 27, 2023 3:32 am
rodrigoxm49 wrote: Mon Jun 26, 2023 1:18 pm
Kronzky wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:54 pm After having watched all the pre-release gameplay videos posted by those veterans, and seeing them fail left and right, I'm starting to worry about about the difficulty level of this game.

After all, these are trained and experienced pros. They survived the real thing, and they should be able to survive the game. But instead, they're dropping like flies.
This would be like handing a race game to Lewis Hamilton, and him wiping out at every other corner. If that happens there's something wrong with the game, not with Lewis Hamilton.

I mean, I'm all for hard games (there are way too few of them), but if you're going for realism then dying should be the exception, rather than the rule. (And should only happen if you really, really screwed up. The real numbers were about 2,000 troops involved, and having 27 deaths. In the game it seems to be the other way round...)
I don't have any problems to not die in this game (it doens't mean that I not die, but it's not too often). I think there's nothing to tweak, at the risk of making the game extremely easy. I haven't seen a single situation where I considered it unfair to have died or been shot. The difficulty is fine, in my opinion. The game is made to be absolutely brutal and have no mercy. US marines are good on real life, a videogame is extremely different even if you know the CQB concepts.

This is not a Mario Bros games, guys. Train, apply the concepts and you will be rewarded. That's the fun of though game, guys.
Dude, thats the point. Not everyone is like you that play so well, keep this lvl of difficulty, fine! Just add other lvls less difficult so more people can enjoy. No one wants to take your fun away, we just want to have fun ourselves. Yeah war is hard, but this a computer game, unless you want to make it just for veterans, and then hope most of them dont get frustrated because they cant succeed here like they did IRL...
I'm not a very good FPS player, man. I'm only decent, having a really bad reaction time compared to the good ones. But I do love CQB games and I play using some knowledge about it. And works really good on this game. Really really well.

Anyway, if it's something that would help the game sell more and devs have the data to prove this, they should put this in the game. I don't have any problem with people tweaking the experience. I have a brutal server on Insurgency Sandstorm and without it I would never play the game. So in a different direction (make the game much harder and tactical), I understand what you asking. But I see a big issue with that in this particularly game. People can think the game is lame depending on what settings you change.

Let's say they put some settings to tweak AI reaction, for example. Adding 100 or 200ms. It could make the game really dummy and game could flop because people on youtube will think the game have bad AI and they will not buy the game, you know? That's something that devs probably have in mind when they not allow to change much the game. There's a workaround for it like a watermark saying the gameplay is not using default settings recommended for the game and what changes was changed. But it could ruin the player experience by having a watermark in the game.

I know that games like these can be frustrating, but I think it's the concept of the game. It's hard, it's though, you will find absolutely no mercy, it's absolutely brutal. But the rewards? Oh, man, it's really amazing when you make it and things work well as planned. Once you start to get good at it, the reward is really satisfying.
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